Mixer for jamming

Pakehendrix · Post by **Pakehendrix** » Wed Oct 17, 2007 11:09 am

Hey guys, just after a quick bit of advice - I'm looking at buying a mixer to use for band practise and jams etc., and was wondering if http://www.trademe.co.nz/Music-instrume ... 331753.htm

would be any good for me? I really don't know much about that kind of stuff...apart from how to use it. It looks like a good deal...so far the band would be 4 piece or at most 5 so I don't think I'd need anything bigger.

rocklander · Post by **rocklander** » Wed Oct 17, 2007 11:23 am

I have that same model.. looks like about RRP from rockshop, so may pay to see them?
is 2 XLR inputs enough for a 5 piece? how many Mics are you using?

what are you going to feed it into?

We use ours purely to manage foldback. our monitor out of the main PA goes to an EQ, then on to this to split the (single used) input to a powered monitor and to an amp for some passive wedges.
good lil unit.

thehenderson · Post by **thehenderson** » Wed Oct 17, 2007 11:23 am

Those same ones retail at the rockshop for $190, I'd buy it from there personally because with low end stuff, a warrenty sounds like a good idea

i think I might get one myself for this electronic tom foolery I'm doing

Pakehendrix · Post by **Pakehendrix** » Wed Oct 17, 2007 11:41 am

rocklander wrote:I have that same model.. looks like about RRP from rockshop, so may pay to see them?
is 2 XLR inputs enough for a 5 piece? how many Mics are you using?

what are you going to feed it into?

We use ours purely to manage foldback. our monitor out of the main PA goes to an EQ, then on to this to split the (single used) input to a powered monitor and to an amp for some passive wedges.
good lil unit.

We'd be using 2 mics...one for main vocals and one for backing. Guitar and bass will just use amplifiers at this stage...unless anyone tells me thats a dumb idea.
I have no idea what I'm going to feed it into...I hadn't thought about that...speakers were next on the shopping list, but I just saw this and thought hey that sounds reasonable.

rocklander · Post by **rocklander** » Wed Oct 17, 2007 11:43 am

it's a passive mixer, so if you fed it to any speakers either they'd need to be active, or you'll need to feed it to an amp that then goes to passive speakers.

to be honest, (I can't believe I'm saying this, but) it would pay to spend a bit more and leave yourself headroom for more inputs. if you want to add another vocal mic, or even maybe mic up the drums, you'll want to have more inputs. personally I wouldn't go for less than 5... but that's just me.

Pakehendrix · Post by **Pakehendrix** » Wed Oct 17, 2007 11:44 am

As you can probably tell, I'm a complete noob to this. I know how to plug one in and set it up but everything else is a mystery...so any general advice on PA for jamming would be much appreciated.

Pakehendrix · Post by **Pakehendrix** » Wed Oct 17, 2007 11:48 am

rocklander wrote:it's a passive mixer, so if you fed it to any speakers either they'd need to be active, or you'll need to feed it to an amp that then goes to passive speakers.

to be honest, (I can't believe I'm saying this, but) it would pay to spend a bit more and leave yourself headroom for more inputs. if you want to add another vocal mic, or even maybe mic up the drums, you'll want to have more inputs. personally I wouldn't go for less than 5... but that's just me.

Ah ok. I'm on a pretty tight budget, and so is the drummer (the only other full member so far) so yeah...you can see why this one looks so attractive.

rocklander · Post by **rocklander** » Wed Oct 17, 2007 11:50 am

there's (basically) two types of mixers. powered and passive. if it's powered (ours is - a gigrac) then you can have passive (they don't have built in amplifiers) speakers because the powered mixer powers them. if you have a passive mixer, something has to power the speakers (either the speakers are powered - have their own internal amplifier) or you need an amplifier between the mixer and the (passive/unpowered) speakers.

each has it's advantaged and disadvantages.
powered mixers are a good start because everything is in the same box, but they're limiting as they can't really be upgraded.
passive desk is more modular. you can sell that desk and get a bigger better one if you have either powered speakers or an amp to power passive speakers.
passive speakers are lighter than powered ones (cos you don't have the added weight) but the weight is simply elsewhere (either the powered mixer, or the external amplifier).

rocklander · Post by **rocklander** » Wed Oct 17, 2007 11:54 am

Pakehendrix wrote: Ah ok. I'm on a pretty tight budget, and so is the drummer (the only other full member so far) so yeah...you can see why this one looks so attractive.

it's real catch22 isn't it? can't get gigs without gear, and can't afford gear without gigs to pay for it... then the tax man wants his bit...

(I'll get in here before BG does) maybe I can try to figure out some way to nail a couple of old TVs together and you could use those...

seriously though.. talk to someone who's already doing/done what you are wanting to do and see what they think.. then talk to some more...
I went for the gigrac cos it was (for that week only) a complete steal.. (like $1K under RRP)... but that still is a bunch of cash mate. dunno what to say.

Pakehendrix · Post by **Pakehendrix** » Wed Oct 17, 2007 11:54 am

Ah I see. Apart from this not having 5 inputs like you said, is this a good deal? (ignoring the fact its Ashton)

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing ... =122845613

Of course, I'm really after this...http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing ... =122942820
but damn it, its $1 reserve! Gosh, who in their right mind........

rocklander · Post by **rocklander** » Wed Oct 17, 2007 11:58 am

I reckon it would be a good start to loko at. need to know what wattage it is.. and have a go on it too to see if it doesn't get lost in the guitar/drums (and to be added bass) mix. probably not going to be any use for anything other than micing up acoustic gigs, but if you practice on it, then hire kit for gigs you may be okay...

course, I'm still relatively noob compared to most here.. am hoping someone who really knows what they're talking about chimes in...

Pakehendrix · Post by **Pakehendrix** » Wed Oct 17, 2007 12:00 pm

Hehe. I just edited the post above ^^ cos I want the Roland stuff...

I think I will ask about the wattage. Trouble is, its in Invercarrrrrgill, and I am in Auckland...

Pakehendrix · Post by **Pakehendrix** » Wed Oct 17, 2007 12:32 pm

This is a little out of the price range at the moment, but do you reckon its something we should work towards? At the rockshop its $1499...http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/ ... sku=600707
but it only comes with mixer, speakers, and 2 cables.

The next one up is $1899, and same deal (no mics, only 2 cables) but bigger mixer and speakers. http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/ ... sku=600717

rocklander · Post by **rocklander** » Wed Oct 17, 2007 12:55 pm

okay, our rig is basically the same in principal. (mainly quality difference really)
gigrac 1000 (which is actually only 600watt @8ohms, but 1000watt if we daisychain the speakers to make them 4ohms) and it's plenty for any of the pub venues we play. (if we need more sound for bigger slightly venues, we add on the extra speakers to get the 1Kwatt). for corporate gigs we get a sound guy and hire a PA off him @whatever the venue needs.

that one's fine, but really may not be up to scratch for gigging. great again for practice and acoustic duo type stuff, or small venues, but a room full of bouncing people will soak up that wattage real quick and leave you no headroom.

if I was starting again? maybe I'd consider a desk. with just the channels you need. when you have the cash get either the powered speakers or an amp + some passive speakers.

I just don't see a 'cheap' option (and anyone who has read any of my posts know I look for that) when it comes to PA.

as it is, our PA was at the lower end of the market, and it was an initial outlay of ~$5K.. and been added to since. that was the gigrac1000, 2X JBL112M speakers (passive) and 1X jbl jrx118sp (powered sub).
we end up using the 112's as monitors now through a crown amp (~$700 2X400watt I think?), eq (~$600 has feedback eliminator), that lil behringer mixer (~150).
the front of house is the gigrac100 (RRP$2.5K?)into 2X Yamaha 15" speakers (bassist owns, but think between $500 and $1000 each), and the sub (~$1600? active). then you've got cables, speaker stands, road cases....she all adds up real quick bro...

Post by **Capt. Black** » Wed Oct 17, 2007 1:20 pm

Pakehendrix, I can't speak highly enough of Michelle at Jansen down on Khyber Pass Road. Do yourself a favour and give her a call.

I can totally recommend the gear they sell. We've just kitted the rehearsal studios with B52 PAs, Phonic and Alto mixers, AT mics etc.
Michelle will give you an honest opinion about the gear and sort you out with the best deal she can for your needs. In all truth, she's the only person out of all the dealers who got off her arse and came up with options for me and that saved me at least a week of shagging about.

If you want to see and hear the stuff in action you're welcome to drop by the studio sometime.

You could argue that there is higher end stuff available but bang for buck this stuff is hard to beat. ie. A lotto win or a rich uncle might help.