All things guitar, Les Pauls, Strats, Teles, Tokai, Ibanez etc. etc. etc.

Moderators: Slowy, Capt. Black

BY foal30
#826823
Arnie van Bussel
Marcus Winstanley
Rob Mayes
Ester Olden

All had skills
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BY philly
#826825
how's it sound?
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BY Capt. Black
#826836
Smartest trick I ever saw was the sound guy at the dogs Bollix years ago. Can’t remember his name but first thing he’d do for each band at sound check was get the monitor mix sorted. As soon as the band were happy with the foldback he could get on with front of house mix without being second guessed from the stage.

As for carving frequencies in a live mix, forget it. I bet there’s less than a hand full here who’ve ever played a gig venue big enough that 90% of the guitar sound wasn’t directly off stage.
I’m one of those assholes that won’t turn down but by and large my sound is nice enough and not so loud that a Soundie can’t get a nice solid front of house mix. (At least, that’s what they tell me) But there’s no way they can control my levels in most venues around Auckland in the last 20 years.

It was a different story back in the day when venues like Mainstreet and Galaxy (now Power Station) were regular venues. They were big rooms with big PAs.
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BY godgrinder
#826837
^ That's basically why most of the modeller-direct-into-board bands sounded gutless live 90% of the times unless they had their own sound guy haha.
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BY MogwaiBoy
#826842
foal30 wrote:Rob Mayes


I love this man. When we toured the South Island, in Chch he took us out for dinner and even brought his treasured Hiwatt halfstack to the Dux de Lux gig specifically for me to use in stereo with the backline amp, just purely out of his own generosity and passion for great sonics.

One of my other favs was the inhouse engineer at the King's Arms - I forget his name, but his presence was seamless... he was so efficient and the sound there was always fantastic on stage and off.

My least fav would be the guy who the Mint Chicks hired to do sound for them in Hamilton. We were the support band and the soundguy literally acosted me in front of everyone as I was approaching the stage to play, essentially putting a hand on my throat and saying shit like "at 10pm, on the dot, I don't give a shit if you're still in the middle of a song, I'm pulling the fucking plug, do you understand? NO, LOOK AT ME, DO YOU UNDERSTAND?" - to this day people say I shouldn't have taken being talked to like that. Ah well. He was a royal jerk. He used 120db of white noise during soundcheck too to identify frequency traps in the room and calibrate etc - it was just over the top. The band were way too cool for school also, and snobbed us and the entire local scene - not a thanks, hello, goodbye or nothing. We supported international acts on world tours and they were far more down to Earth.
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BY Capt. Black
#826844
MogwaiBoy wrote:One of my other favs was the inhouse engineer at the King's Arms - I forget his name, but his presence was seamless... he was so efficient and the sound there was always fantastic on stage and off.



You’re thinking of Mark Peterson. He was fantastic and one of the coolest guys. He’s resident sound guy at Whammy bar now which is making that venue a lot more popular to play at.

It cracked me up a few years ago when Mark was suddenly in the news getting inducted into the NZ music hall of fame. None of us had realised he was ex-Straitjacket Fits!

I think I know who that threatening asshole sound guy might be too. He’s actually pretty good at his job but not a “people person” :lol:
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BY jeremyb
#826845
Joseph Veale is another outstanding Christchurch engineer, laid back and awesome mix, he's been touring with the chills in the States recently too!!
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BY Lawrence
#826850
heres a perspective...(mine :wink: )

Unless the Engineer has rehearsed with the band extensively and been part of the creative process it is NOT the engineers job to decide how the band sounds. Instrument tones (including Drums) are the responsibility of the band, as are dynamics, solo levels, vocal balance (obviously not the band/vocal balance, but the balance between vocals).

The primary job of live sound enginere who works for the venue or the sound contractor is to safely run the system while ensuring that the FOH and Foldback EQ has removed any resonances and is appropriate for the venue.

Once that factor is under control, their next job is to try and balance the sound in an attempt to replicate what the bands intentions are. This is informed by the stage mix....If one guitarist is much louder on stage then the other then the only reasonable conclusion an engineer can draw is that the FOH mix should also have one much louder than the other.

On the issue of EQ....For Drums it is reasonable to expect the engineer to find and reduce any resonances that are clouding the kit - but initially it is the drummers job to arrive with a well tuned kit. For guitars the FOH sound should match what is coming out of the amp...Basically any other changes should be approached extremely cautiously by the engineer.

Now obviously, good engineers will have both the venue and the bands best interest at heart and will then build on the platform as described to enhance and refine the mix to give the audience the best possible experience. This may include subtle EQ and FX...and most importantly maintaining a good balance. (I am old school...if the engineer does not have a finger on the lead vocal fader the whole time there is singing they are either lazy - or there is too much compression :o....or, OK, the singer might be a well rehearsed profesional.... )

I am fully aware these views may seem odd.....and of course all of this changes if the Engineer is essentially a member of the band. I can say that I applied this approach very successfully when working with experienced musicians to great success with many industry folk coming to celebrate the gigs sound with me.


.....now attack!
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BY The Scarecrow
#826851
MogwaiBoy wrote:
One of my other favs was the inhouse engineer at the King's Arms - I forget his name, but his presence was seamless... he was so efficient and the sound there was always fantastic on stage and off.
.


You're thinking of Mark. Caveman looking dude who was the politest, most patience soundie I've ever dealt with. Perfect sound every time.
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BY Scooter13
#826855
These guys don't know what they're talking about in respect to more modern/heavy music sometimes, but they largely hit the nail on the head in this episode:
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BY bbrunskill
#826856
MogwaiBoy wrote:
My least fav would be the guy who the Mint Chicks hired to do sound for them in Hamilton. We were the support band and the soundguy literally acosted me in front of everyone as I was approaching the stage to play, essentially putting a hand on my throat and saying shit like "at 10pm, on the dot, I don't give a shit if you're still in the middle of a song, I'm pulling the fucking plug, do you understand? NO, LOOK AT ME, DO YOU UNDERSTAND?" - to this day people say I shouldn't have taken being talked to like that. Ah well. He was a royal jerk. He used 120db of white noise during soundcheck too to identify frequency traps in the room and calibrate etc - it was just over the top. The band were way too cool for school also, and snobbed us and the entire local scene - not a thanks, hello, goodbye or nothing. We supported international acts on world tours and they were far more down to Earth.


I suspect I know who this is. He's actually a good dude, works hard, wants to make the show the best it can be and does a really great job. But he's completely and utterly lacking in any form of people skills.

He gave me an utter bollocking once when I was the system tech for a large kiwi jam/reggae band, because he asked me how I had set the delays on the main PA.

'By Ear' was my answer and he absolutely tore me a new one. Funny thing was that after he spent the next 20 minutes fixing my 'fuck ups' I checked his delay times - and they were exactly the same. I had the same result just by a different method. I'm pretty sure he bad mouthed me to the band/management because I haven't worked for them since.
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BY bbrunskill
#826857
Lawrence wrote:heres a perspective...(mine :wink: )

Unless the Engineer has rehearsed with the band extensively and been part of the creative process it is NOT the engineers job to decide how the band sounds. Instrument tones (including Drums) are the responsibility of the band, as are dynamics, solo levels, vocal balance (obviously not the band/vocal balance, but the balance between vocals).



Well said. I could not agree more.

I met a sound guy at a jazz gig who got the most amazing drum sound with 4 mics- Kick and Snare for punch and a pair of overheads for an overall picture, and I've stolen that technique many times.

As I'm setting it up, various drummers have said something along the lines of 'Are you not going to mic my toms/HiHat/whatever?' and I really enjoy telling them, nope I'm not. I'm going to have overheads up loud, in the mix, and I'm going to give you total control. If you want the toms really loud, hit them hard. Mix yourself. They usually start grinning at that point.

The best possible sound is a really good band, with really good onstage tones and band dynamics, mic'd up correctly, into a PA that is optimised to the space, and then mostly left alone, apart from subtle changes to the overall balance and sometimes some FX.
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BY Terexgeek
#826859
bbrunskill wrote:
MogwaiBoy wrote:
My least fav would be the guy who the Mint Chicks hired to do sound for them in Hamilton. We were the support band and the soundguy literally acosted me in front of everyone as I was approaching the stage to play, essentially putting a hand on my throat and saying shit like "at 10pm, on the dot, I don't give a shit if you're still in the middle of a song, I'm pulling the fucking plug, do you understand? NO, LOOK AT ME, DO YOU UNDERSTAND?" - to this day people say I shouldn't have taken being talked to like that. Ah well. He was a royal jerk. He used 120db of white noise during soundcheck too to identify frequency traps in the room and calibrate etc - it was just over the top. The band were way too cool for school also, and snobbed us and the entire local scene - not a thanks, hello, goodbye or nothing. We supported international acts on world tours and they were far more down to Earth.


I suspect I know who this is. He's actually a good dude, works hard, wants to make the show the best it can be and does a really great job. But he's completely and utterly lacking in any form of people skills.

He gave me an utter bollocking once when I was the system tech for a large kiwi jam/reggae band, because he asked me how I had set the delays on the main PA.

'By Ear' was my answer and he absolutely tore me a new one. Funny thing was that after he spent the next 20 minutes fixing my 'fuck ups' I checked his delay times - and they were exactly the same. I had the same result just by a different method. I'm pretty sure he bad mouthed me to the band/management because I haven't worked for them since.

Your definition of "Good dude" and mine are different.
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BY The Scarecrow
#826863
MogwaiBoy wrote: The band were way too cool for school also, and snobbed us and the entire local scene - not a thanks, hello, goodbye or nothing. We supported international acts on world tours and they were far more down to Earth.


That's been my experience with many supposed "big" or "top tier" Kiwi bands I've dealt with, sadly. It's almost like a taste of fame is directly linked to an increase in wankery :thumbdown: